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Are outdoor resent sensors interchangable?

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Wellness
Wellness Member Posts: 141
in THE MAIN WALL
I using a Honeywell AQ25144B zone control and Prestige solo boiler. The  Prestige's outdoor sensor kit is much nicer looking and--more importantly--sturdier than the Honeywell's. Question is, does anybody know if they are interchangeable, since they both have 2-wire leads and are just reporting outdoor temps?

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  • JStar
    JStar Member Posts: 2,752
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    RE

    I've found that most sensors are different. They read different resistance. You can always modify the outer case to fit one inside the other for looks.
  • Bob Vennerbeck
    Bob Vennerbeck Member Posts: 105
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    maybe...

    The Triangle Tube Prestige Solo 110 that I installed late 2009 shipped (from PexSupply.com) with a Honeywell TA-1 Outdoor Air Sensor.

    Sturdy round plastic outdoor housing, labeled on back: "TYPE: SO10076 // SENS: NTC 12K"

    The Honeywell housing has an o-ring seal and gland for wiring to provide a tighter weather seal, if that matters. Baby circuit board exposed inside with nice shrouded terminal block.



    The Triangle Tube Prestige Excellence that I am installing right now shipped (from PexSupply.com) with a Triangle Tube PSSENS01Outdoor Sensor Kit. Enclosure is round base with potted sensor, and rectangular cover. No visible indication of sensor type.

    The TT housing is not really sealed, just splash-proofed, which might make it respond faster to air temp changes - but is that a benefit?



    Since the two boilers are fundamentally identical as far as space heating controls and logic are concerned, I would be inclined to think the sensors are interchangeable - but why not ask Triangle Tube themselves?



    NTC 12k is a fairly generic description of a Negative Temperature Coefficient Thermistor - component costs about as much as a cup of coffee - and since outdoor reset wants to respond to general trend of outdoor temperature, fast response time and fractional degree precision are less important than really good low-resistance connections and carefully selected placement on the exterior.



    Full disclosure: I know more about electronics than boilers.



    Vbob



    PS: scanned image with black background is the Honeywell; white with red ruler is the TT.
  • CMadatMe
    CMadatMe Member Posts: 3,086
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    Call PEX Supply

    Since you purchased the boiler from them should they not be able to support you? Sorry know the answer but don't have a .com address where you can swipe a credit card to get it.
    "The bitter taste of a poor installation remains much longer than the sweet taste of the lowest price."
  • KBP&H_3
    KBP&H_3 Member Posts: 67
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    Diffferent Sensors

    I've run across two different groups of sensors  10K and     12K,   Usually the manufacturer ( brand) will have a sheet listing the resistance at different temperatures, I wouldn't advise changing between different brands for different sensors, unless all of the resistances match the different temps.  you could end up with some wacky problems,

    I usually use the Honeywell case as it's well designed and has room for two sensors. The airflow thru the case doesn't matter, as it won't hold heat or cold longer than the system response.
  • Ron Jr._3
    Ron Jr._3 Member Posts: 603
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    Funny ............

    Charging for advice , that is .



    Goes against the whole idea of this forum .



    Where anyone is welcome to ask questions. No matter where their equipment is purchased .
  • Mark Eatherton
    Mark Eatherton Member Posts: 5,853
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    Sour apples ??

    Even if he HAD known where to get in contact with you, you probably wouldn't have sold to him any way Chris. Or at least I HOPE you wouldn't sell to them...



    To the O.P., even if a sensor has a 70 degree F @ 10K ohms, it can have a different alpha curve characteristic. I wouldn't suggest you try cross pollinating the sensors. It could cause your system to work improperly.



    ME
    It's not so much a case of "You got what you paid for", as it is a matter of "You DIDN'T get what you DIDN'T pay for, and you're NOT going to get what you thought you were in the way of comfort". Borrowed from Heatboy.
  • CMadatMe
    CMadatMe Member Posts: 3,086
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    Rotten Apples

    It just boils my blood Mark. Buy because I don't want to pay for a pro but go to the pro when I'm in too deep or need help.
    "The bitter taste of a poor installation remains much longer than the sweet taste of the lowest price."
  • Bob Vennerbeck
    Bob Vennerbeck Member Posts: 105
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    lemons? make lemonade!

    I seem to have pushed some buttons.... my bad.



    Local distributor did not have a Prestige Solo on hand when I needed one a year or three ago - and when they realized I was a mere homeowner, declined to order one in, even with 100% deposit. So PexSupply.com got one in my hands in three days, and considerably cheaper. I would have preferred to buy local, in hopes that when and if I needed parts support they'd be there for me - but then again, maybe they wouldn't.



    Be that as is may, I don't know if the 'accessories' (outdoor sensor, air vent, pressure safety valve, etc) packed with both my Triangle Tubes were supplied by TT, or kitted up by PexSupply - thus I was explicit about where they had come from, and which boilers had which outdoor sensors.



    For what it's worth, PexSupply has quickly and freely answered a number of my questions - usually by putting up links to manuals that are otherwise buried cryptically deep in mfg, websites.





    The OP said nothing about where the equipment was purchased, or how the system was designed - as I review that post, I realize that he's got two pieces of equipment wanting outdoor sensors - the Prestige itself, and the Honeywell reset control. Maybe that's a great plan, and maybe not - it does make me wonder, if I'm allowed to do that...





    Online manual for Honeywell AQ25144B says it uses 10k NTC thermistors for sensors, and the Triangle Tube literature doesn't specify anywhere I can find it (yet) - but one of them shipped with one marked 12k NTC, and has been operating nicely two winters, springs, and autumns now, so I'm going to assume it's correct.



    So I hereby revise my inappropriately offered free amateur advice from 'maybe' to 'probably not a good idea'.



    I've gotten great advice here, and some interesting lessons in how to phrase questions. (Even though I didn't ask this one!)



    I've tried to give back to the community as my strengths and opportunities allow, and I've always been straight forward about my qualifications and experience.



    ALWAYS eager to learn - and VERY grateful for answers that explain 'why', even when it would be easy to say 'hire a pro to follow the directions'.



    Vbob
  • bill_105
    bill_105 Member Posts: 429
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    Dear Bob,

    After all that, Is the guy's sensors okay or not??
  • Mark Eatherton
    Mark Eatherton Member Posts: 5,853
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    Well....

    It's human nature to find the best deal you can Chris. We are ALL guilty of it.



    At least this person had the cajones to go on line and ask questions.



    These help for pay web sites are a REAL rip off in my minds eye. No way they can ever do a complete troubleshooting/diagnosis over a PC.



    Get over it and move on. The name of the place is Heating Help.com, not Heating Help for those with credit cards only.com



    ME



    (My next company name will be H.E.L.P.Inc. Which stands for Heeney Energy, Light and Power Company)
    It's not so much a case of "You got what you paid for", as it is a matter of "You DIDN'T get what you DIDN'T pay for, and you're NOT going to get what you thought you were in the way of comfort". Borrowed from Heatboy.
  • Boiler_Controls
    Boiler_Controls Member Posts: 3
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    Honeywell Outdoor Temperature Sensors

    Here’s the complete detail. 10K and 12K are the resistances at 25 Deg C. But then there are different curves over the entire temperature range as well. So the 10K or 12K number alone isn’t complete in specifying these parts. The SO10076 is a 12K part compatible with the MCBA control that is used on the Prestige and other boilers.

    Unfortunately Honeywell and other control manufactures don’t have a common outdoor sensor as this certainly makes your lives harder. The reason is that some controls are designed in Europe (which prefers 12K sensors) and some in the U.S. Further, if the temperature is to be displayed on the boiler or thermostat there is an expectation of accuracy by the homeowner that exceeds what may be needed at the boiler. If it’s 65 Deg f outside the boiler doesn’t really care, but the homeowner is comparing this thermostat display with the inexpensive system outside their kitchen window. So sensors used for boilers may have lesser accuracy requirements then those designed for display.

    So that’s the story – more then you may have wanted. Bottom line is be safe and use the exact sensor recommended by the boiler manufacture.

     

    Rich Simons

    Honeywell Residential Oil/Hydronics Business
  • Plumdog_2
    Plumdog_2 Member Posts: 873
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    Sensor Talk

    Exactly what I was gonna say........
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